2010年08月16日

他のと重複する情報ですが

1995/8/27, posted by Joseph H. Peterson

Kelley introduced himself to Dee on March 8, 1582 (old calendar) under the assumed name of Edward Talbot. He gave Dee his real name prior to November 15 after an apparent falling out of 6 months duration. The treasure map was delivered to Dee on March 22, 1583. Kelley told Dee (see pg 125 of my 1985 edition) that he had found it in Northwil Hill along with a boke (Book of St. Dunstan) and an alchemical powder. Dee was very worried about getting into trouble with the law if he went around digging for the treasures, and was therefore instructed by the spirits to bring back samples of earth from the locations revealed in the scroll, wherewith they would produce the treasures magically. Kelley went off on this errand on May 10 and returned May 22. However, the spirits never did produce the promised treasure.

Note also that one of Dee's first questions of the spirits at their March 1st session ("action") was how he read a mysterious book he had come to possess. This line of query continued and remained unsatisfied as far as I can tell from his manuscripts. He called this mysterious manuscript Soyga and told the spirits, "Oh, my great and long desyre hath byn to be hable to read those Tables of Soyga." (pg 12 of my 1985 edition)
posted by ぶらたん at 23:15| Comment(0) | John Dee

2010年07月16日

John Deeの年表

ジョン・ディーとケリーについては後で情報が必要なため、投稿。

1992/1/2, posted by Jacques Guy quoting Donald Laycock's note.

"According to the horoscope he later cast himself, John Dee was born at Mortlake on the morning of 13 July, 1527, under the sign of Cancer, with Sagittarius in ascendent....
He graduated Master of Arts from Cambridge in 1548, and went abroad to study further at Louvain. Later he gave lectures at the University of Paris... It is not known just when he began to seek or achieve efective communications with the beings he regarded as angles, but it was probably not before 1581. From about March of that year, as we learn from his Private Diary, he was troubled by odd dreams, and strange knockings in the night... by October of that year Dee had found a medium, one Barnabas Saul, who, using as a crystal a stone given Dee by a 'friend', reported to Dee the words of the angel Annael and Michael -- and who later denied seeing any spirits at all, for fear of prosecution for conjuring. But Dee was dissatisfied with Saul as a medium, and dismissed him...

... there appeared at his house in Mortlake on 8 March 1582 a man calling himself Edward Talbot, afterwards to be known by his true name of Edward Kelley.
Kelley was about twenty-seven years old at the time.... He was not uneducated;
he had been an undergraduate at Oxford, but was apparently dismissed. He spoke Latin well enough to travel in Europe, and converse with Dee's Continental friends; he makes frequent grammatical mistakes, but of his general intelligence there is no doubt.... on 10 March that year Dee was giving the new medium a trial -- with results so successful that there began on that day a strange and close association between the two men that was to last for some seven years...
on 26 March 1582, Edward Kelley produced the first material concerning the 'angelicall language.' [Enochian].... The wife-swapping episode took place, in spite if the attempts of some biographers of Dee to suggest that it did not.
In the original manuscripts there is a section, heavily erased and barely legible, recording the seance of 23 May 1587 -- the morning after the wife-swapping. The spirits ask Kelley:'Was thy brother's wife [Jane Dee] obedient and humble unto thee?' -- and Kelley replies:'She was.' Dee returns the same answer concerning Joanna Kelley.
Dee's association with Kelley, and apparently also with the Enochian angles, ended shortly after this episode -- perhaps the tensions in that household of two British couples in Bohemia were becoming too much to bear, and Kelley set himself up as an alchemist in a separate establishment.
Nevertheless, the Dees did not leave for England until March 1589, arriving there in December of that year. Kelley stayed on at the court of Emperor Rudolph in Prague, and died there in 1595 -- under obscure conditions. (The usual story is that he was imprisoned for failing to produce alchemical gold, and fell from a tower when trying to escape.)"

=============================================

Quoting from "The Private Diary of Dr. John Dee and The Catalogue of his Library of Manuscripts, from the Original Manuscripts in the Ashmolean Museum at Oxford, and Trinity College Library, Cambridge," edited by James Orchard Halliewell

1586.

Oct. 18th, E K [Edward Kelly, the brother of Thomas] recessit a Treoona versus Pragam cumu delatus; masit hic per tres hebdomadas.

Nov. 8 illustrissimus princeps [probably Prince Albert Leski] versus Pragam; iter institit hor tertia a meridie.

Dec. 30 E K versus Pragam.

1587.

Jan. 14th Reinholdt [Dr. Reinholdt of Salfeldt] revisit versus Pragam 20 die.

Jan. 18th rediit E K a Praga. E K brought with him from the Lord Rosenberg to my wyfe a chayne and juelle estemed at 300 duckettes; 200 the juell stones, and 100 the gold.

Jan. 21st E K again to Prage and so to Poland ward.

March 7th E K dedit nobis 300 ducata.

March 21st E K gave me 170 more, and of the 200 for changing 60 remain.

Sept. 26th my lord [Lord Biberstein] went toward Prage

Sept. 30th, T K [Thomas Kelley] and J C [John Carp] went toward Prage.

Oct. 12th Mr. E K toward Prage on horsbak.

Oct. 26th Mr. Edward Kelly cam to Trebona from Prage.

1588.

Oct. 25th, Mr. Ed. Kelley and John Carpio rode toward Prage.

Nov. 6 Mr Kelly cam home from Prage.

Dec. 4th I gave to Mr. Ed. Kelley my Glass, so highly and long estemed of our Quene, and the Emperor Randolph the second, de quo in praefatione Euclidis fit mentio. [The editor says that this refers to Dee's preface of Billinglsley's (and perhaps Dee's) translation of Euclid's Elements.]

Dec 23. Radulphus Sagiensis Gallus Nomannus, venit Trebonam, chimiae et naturalis magiae studiosis.

1589.

Jan. 3rd Rudolphus Sagiensis Normannus recessit versus Pragam.

Apr. 19th I delivered by letters to Mr Thomas Kelley for his brother Sir Edward Kelly, knight, at Emperor's court at Prage.
posted by ぶらたん at 17:34| Comment(0) | John Dee

Book of Soyga

Deeが持っていたBook of Soygaはヴォイニッチ手稿なのか?
同一であれば、ケリーの捏造だし、
そうでなければ、どのようにルドルフ二世の手に渡ったのか。

どうやら確認はできないみたいですね。

1991/12/30, posted by Jacques Guy
What, will you ask, has all that to do with the Voynich manuscript? At the most, little I dare say. Dee and Kelley spent much of their later years in eastern Europe (Poland and what is now Czechoslovakia).
Kelley died in Bohemia under obscure circumstances, whereas Dee went back to England. On p.170 of the Complete Enochian Dictonary, there is this entry:
soyga

will of God (?) (The Book of Soyga was one of Dee's holy books; the spirits said it was not a reversal of the Greek agios, holy.)

to which you must add this pers. com. from Donald Laycock: there is, in Dee's diaries, a note to this effect: "How strange, I cannot find my Book of Soyga". According to Don, Dee's "Book of Soyga" may have been the Voynich manuscript, and Kelley would have stolen it and sold it to Rudolph II, emperor of Bohemia.

そういえばダンスタン手稿というのもあったな。
SoygaとDunstanて違うものだったっけ?

Dec. 12th, afternone somewhat, Mr. Ed. Keley his lamp overthrow, the spirit of wyne long spent to nere, and the glas being not stayed with buks about it, as it was wont to be, the spirit was spilled out...
and, to make a long story short, a bunch of books caught on fire, including the "Book of Dunstan." (Glancing through his diary it's remarkable how many bizarre accidents happened to Dee... perhaps a result of dealings with evil
spirits. Does the above mean that Kelley was drunk??)

1996/7/24, posted by Jim Reeds

Subject: Book of Soyga

I want to apologize for the air of mystery I might have created about my recent interest in a certain unnamed 1500's magic book; this letter is intended to clear things up.

Last year, at the John Dee conference in London, Prof. Harkness of Colgate University announced that she had found, at long last, the Book of Soyga. It had been sitting there all along in the Bodleian. Everyone else had looked for "Soyga" in the card catalogue; Harkness had the wit to look under "Aldaraia", and there it was!

It indeed starts "Aldaraia sive Soyga vocor" and has "zadzaczadlin," just as it should.

My wife met Harkness at a conference and brought the happy news to me. I pestered Harkness about the Book of Soyga in the hopes that it might have some relation to the Voynich MS. She lent me her microfilms (it turns out the British Library has another copy) and I have been looking at the thing with awe for several weeks.

It presents a magic system of its own, as different from Dee's magic as Dee's is from Agrippa's (or more so), pretty clearly not itself derived from Agrippa's magic, but with a vaguely similar Cabbalistic cast. (Maybe closer to Lull than Agrippa in some ways?) Letters have numerical values, planets and zodiac houses have letters, combinations of letters are associated with conjunctions, reference is made to a suite of 36 letter tables each with 36 rows and columns.

At first impression it seems just like the sort of thing that would have appealed to Dee. We all know that Dee was rather puzzled by this book, though, and it is unclear how much of an influence it had on Dee's Enochian system.
posted by ぶらたん at 15:57| Comment(0) | John Dee

2010年07月15日

ジョン・ディーのAuthorship

1991/12/12, posted by Jim Reeds

> Do any illustrations exist in any other of Dee's works?

Yes. Check out any of the recent books about Dee. It is not at all impossible that he was the author. But consider: (1) Dee was an honest man, and (2) Dee might have been the victim not author of hoax, so the hoaxer prepares it so it will appeal to Dee's known style, or (3) Dee's style is shared by other late 16-th century astrology hackers. Have you read Francis Yeats's books, which give a general survey of the ambient Neoplatonic circle of ideas which would have been shared (known, if not adhered to) by hoaxer and hoaxee at the time?

ジョン・ディーが作者である可能性は否定できないが、
@彼は誠実であり、
Aディー自身が詐欺の被害者である可能性(ディーのスタイルをまねた?)
Bディーのスタイルは当時の占星術の標準的なものであった
を言っています。
posted by ぶらたん at 23:34| Comment(0) | John Dee

Dee, Enochian, and the Voynich MS

Dee, Enochian, and the Voynich MS

posted by Jacques Guy

The only serious reference on Enochian, short of going back to Dee's diaries in the British Museum, is "The Complete Enochian Dictionary - A Dictionary of the Angelic Language as revealed to Dr John Dee and Edward Kelley" by Donald Clarence Laycock, London: Askin Publishers, 1978. Rather, the only serious reference I knew of until today (11 Dec 91), when I read about Whitby's 1988 "John Dee's Actions With Spirits".

Don Laycock's book contains the complete corpus of all Enochian texts, with interlinear translations from Dee's diaries, an Enochian-English and English-Enochian dictionary, with a pronunciation key, and the story of how Enochian came about. What it does not contain is Don Laycock's personal opinion: Enochian is a fabrication by Kelley, who was a con-artist a la Uri Geller; the phonology of Enochian is nothing but that of Elizabethan English of the period; the vocabulary is amish-mash of distorted Greek, Hebrew, Latin, and names of spirits and demons, all of which Kelley was likely to have picked up rummaging through Dee's copious library; the grammar makes no sense, and is proof that the language is a fabrication.

How do I know? Don Laycock and I were in the same department of the Australian National University for 15 years, three or four doors apart, belonged to the same poker school, and talked extensively about strange languages, including that of the Voynich manuscript. In his "Complete Enochian Dictionary" Don is careful to keep neutral on the matter of the authenticity of Enochian for this understandable reason that Askin is a publisher of occult books, and his readers would not have been amused at reading Don's true opionions.

One interesting point: Don was convinced that Dee had owned the Voynich manuscript, and it was Kelley who had stolen it and sold it to Rudolph of Bohemia. His reasons to believe so were that Dee has been in Prague with Kelley in tow at times compatible with the first mention of the Voynich manuscript, and one remark in Dee's diary, after his return to England, to this effect: "How strange, I cannot find my book of Soyga".

On this (to me) slim evidence Don thought that Dee's "Book of Soyga" was in fact the Voynich manuscript, and that Kelley had swiped it.

ヴォイニッチ手稿の所有者として、常にジョン・ディーが出てきますが、その根拠がジョン・ディーが持っていた暗号本で、それを皇帝ルドルフ2世に売り払ったという説があります。
もはや誰も証明できないのですが、エノク語は英語と構造が似ていて、暗号ではないし、それとヴォイニッチの暗号は全く似ていません。ケリーがねつ造したとして、どのような手法を使えばヴォイニッチの単語の出現頻度分布を再現できるかなど調べてみたいですね。ちなみに『The Complete Enochian Dictionary』私も持ってます。
posted by ぶらたん at 22:54| Comment(0) | John Dee
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